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- From: Andreas Abel <andreas.abel AT ifi.lmu.de>
- To: Daniel Schepler <dschepler AT gmail.com>
- Cc: Dan Doel <dan.doel AT gmail.com>, coq-club AT inria.fr, Adam Chlipala <adamc AT csail.mit.edu>, AUGER C�dric <Cedric.Auger AT lri.fr>, Benjamin Werner <benjamin.werner AT inria.fr>, Gyesik Lee <gslee AT hknu.ac.kr>, Hugo Herbelin <Hugo.Herbelin AT inria.fr>
- Subject: Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle
- Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 10:47:01 +0100
Good, so you quickly reconstructed the counterexample that I new to exist somewhere!
The additional ingredient to non-strict positivity you needed is a second universe above the impredicative one, and you have to place the non-strictly positive definition into that second higher universe.
However, this does not exclude non-strictly positive types in Prop.
* Since clever people like Chung-Kil can get them through the back door anyway, why not allow them outright?
* I'd bet that the proof-irrelevant set-theoretical model of Werner and Lee does support non-strictly positive types in Prop.
* I conjecture realizability models also support them.
Cheers,
Andreas
On 20.01.12 10:55 PM, Daniel Schepler wrote:
Actually, I guess that also gives an example of a positive, but not
strictly positive, inductive definition which would lead to a contradiction:
Inductive X : Type :=
| X_const : ((X->Prop)->Prop) -> X.
If Coq allowed that definition, then X_const, being a constructor, would
automatically be injective, leading to the contradiction from my
previous message. (Plus, I'm not at all sure what X_rect or X_ind would
look like in that case.)
--
Daniel Schepler
--
Andreas Abel <>< Du bist der geliebte Mensch.
Theoretical Computer Science, University of Munich
Oettingenstr. 67, D-80538 Munich, GERMANY
andreas.abel AT ifi.lmu.de
http://www2.tcs.ifi.lmu.de/~abel/
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, (continued)
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle,
Dan Doel
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Daniel Schepler
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Daniel Schepler
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Dan Doel
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Daniel Schepler
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Dan Doel
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Daniel Schepler
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Dan Doel
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, roconnor
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Daniel Schepler
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle,
Dan Doel
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Andreas Abel
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, AUGER Cédric
- Message not available
- Re: [Coq-Club] Positivity and Elimination Principle, Daniel Schepler
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